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nomailcomein

FUNFACT: Kanye West lets nomailcomein finish before giving his opinion.

shoulder fatigue: is it natural?

Hello,

My new Perfecto 613 features shorter shoulder length than my preowned jackets(For choosing a classic, I don't go size up.).

I'm trying to breaking in 613, I can feel fatigue at shouders.

Is it usual during breaking in?

Gail on 04/07/18 at 09:20 AM

I am not sure what you mean by fatigue in the shoulders. I am also not sure what style numbers your other preowned jackets are. You have stated you do not size up even when it is advised to do so, this is your choice but this may possible be your shoulder problem. We advise on our site to size up to provide the jacket size that will fit you. We still cut the 613 & 618 on the original patterns which are about 1 size smaller in measurements then updated fits of today. If you order a size 40, the measurements are closer to a size 38. Some of our customers do not order up such as yourself because they want a very tight snug fit, but based on an individuals own measurements the jacket may be too tight in certain areas such as the shoulders.

Gail

nomailcomein on 04/07/18 at 11:49 AM

Gail wrote:

I am not sure what you mean by fatigue in the shoulders. I am also not sure what style numbers your other preowned jackets are. You have stated you do not size up even when it is advised to do so, this is your choice but this may possible be your shoulder problem. We advise on our site to size up to provide the jacket size that will fit you. We still cut the 613 & 618 on the original patterns which are about 1 size smaller in measurements then updated fits of today. If you order a size 40, the measurements are closer to a size 38. Some of our customers do not order up such as yourself because they want a very tight snug fit, but based on an individuals own measurements the jacket may be too tight in certain areas such as the shoulders.

Gail

Thanks for your answer.

The preowned jackets I mentioned above are some of the blazers, etc. Not Schott's jacket.

Some of the online shops(EU, not US) recommend to choose true to size because it fits snug but not looks fitted. Pictures featuring model with 613 are not my taste at all. I prefer Ramones or bad boy look pioneered in the 1950’s.

But if it does not looks really bad, as you mentioned in other thread I've created, it might worth to try break in. Besides, the jacket is already worn and was international shipped item, I have no choice for it.

Gail on 04/09/18 at 07:29 AM

In purchasing any item you cannot compare different styling such as a blazer to a motorcycle jacket, both styled jackets have different uses which have different fits. You also cannot compare sizing between different companies, each company have their own designers, patterns and styles. I understand you want the look of the Ramones, as many people do, but as you must know if you researched the Ramone's jacket, their jackets were several sizes smaller then their chest sizes. The jackets were worn being unable to zip up and the sleeves much too short for a jacket. They wore the jackets as part of their stage icon dress appearance and not as a actual riding jacket. I am quite sure the shoulders were also very tight on them too, with wear the jacket will break-in, will it ever be a comfortable fit in the shoulder area is questionable, especially if you have broad shoulders.

Gail

nomailcomein on 04/09/18 at 09:45 AM

Gail wrote:

In purchasing any item you cannot compare different styling such as a blazer to a motorcycle jacket, both styled jackets have different uses which have different fits. You also cannot compare sizing between different companies, each company have their own designers, patterns and styles. I understand you want the look of the Ramones, as many people do, but as you must know if you researched the Ramone's jacket, their jackets were several sizes smaller then their chest sizes. The jackets were worn being unable to zip up and the sleeves much too short for a jacket. They wore the jackets as part of their stage icon dress appearance and not as a actual riding jacket. I am quite sure the shoulders were also very tight on them too, with wear the jacket will break-in, will it ever be a comfortable fit in the shoulder area is questionable, especially if you have broad shoulders.

Gail

Can you tell me the shoulder length of 38 and 40 size of 613, 36 and 38 size of 118?

Noabaak on 04/09/18 at 10:49 AM

Good morning, I am just a voice in the desert. Who knows, maybe someone will find it helpful. :)

Size is a subjective matter. No matter who wears what, who says what, it is I who will wear it. It is a history of personal patterning & preference. If you feel something uncomfortable, that means you are wearing something new that stands against your history. 

To me, a men's top size is based on "chest" foremost, and one needs to measure his own chest with a tape ruler and should know it all the time. Unless you have a different shape or a specific jacket is in a wacky proportion, all else  follow this same golden rule. That is how Ready-To-Wear (RTW) market is established. My advice is, Measure your chest first, then measure the jacket (laid flat, zipped up). If that fits, everything else is a minor problem and you can easily alter. 

If you had picked something smaller (than your chest size) and now makes you feel constrictive everywhere else, since you have no choice but to keep, you can sell that and get another one, possibly the next size up. Maybe the best thing would be to visit Schott store or local dealers and try them on to double check your decision (yes before you sell it). Buy it on the spot if you like something. The leather jackets are vastly hand made, even same size can feel different from time to time, so there is always a factor of luck as well.

Again if you feel uncomfortable in that jacket, getting numbers from Gail would not resolve or justify it.

Size is a preference and that is a personal thing.  

 

 

Gail on 04/10/18 at 07:59 AM

In regards to the jacket measurements of a jacket style, you can contact Denise in our customer service and request she email you the spec sheet for the jacket.

Noabaak, Thank you for confirming what I try to convey to questions asking what size to purchase. I can always tell what size you are, but I can not tell you the size based on a fit preference. Also noted other body measurements that are not in proportion can effect the size needed. 

Gail

RobertJ on 04/10/18 at 11:34 AM

Noabaak wrote:

Good morning, I am just a voice in the desert. Who knows, maybe someone will find it helpful. :)

Size is a subjective matter. No matter who wears what, who says what, it is I who will wear it. It is a history of personal patterning & preference. If you feel something uncomfortable, that means you are wearing something new that stands against your history. 

To me, a men's top size is based on "chest" foremost, and one needs to measure his own chest with a tape ruler and should know it all the time. Unless you have a different shape or a specific jacket is in a wacky proportion, all else  follow this same golden rule. That is how Ready-To-Wear (RTW) market is established. My advice is, Measure your chest first, then measure the jacket (laid flat, zipped up). If that fits, everything else is a minor problem and you can easily alter. 

If you had picked something smaller (than your chest size) and now makes you feel constrictive everywhere else, since you have no choice but to keep, you can sell that and get another one, possibly the next size up. Maybe the best thing would be to visit Schott store or local dealers and try them on to double check your decision (yes before you sell it). Buy it on the spot if you like something. The leather jackets are vastly hand made, even same size can feel different from time to time, so there is always a factor of luck as well.

Again if you feel uncomfortable in that jacket, getting numbers from Gail would not resolve or justify it.

Size is a preference and that is a personal thing.  

 

 

 

I agree. And I have had Schott jackets that were unbearably tight when I first acquired them, and they now fit like custom. It takes patience. This is a leather jacket and not a goddamned bath robe.

nomailcomein on 04/10/18 at 02:25 PM

Thanks for all the opinions.

Actually, I'm regretting about my decision that not size up.

I'm currently looking for somewhere to sell this jacket, but your comments make me hesitate(And I don't think I can sell the jacket in good price in my region. They don't know about Schott).

I have no idea how it will broken in and how much it'll stretch, but until now, it pushs my shoulders quite unpleasantly, and it restricts my movement greatly. I can't fold my arms completely and sometimes my arms become numb. And will the shoulder stretch?

Because I have similar experience with other branded jacket(which has much shorter arms, no bi-swing back, despite 4 years of wearing I failed to accommodate with it), I'm not sure if it's okay. And it might be because of my mood, the shoulder line does not looks right. Pictures I uploaded do not show enough. Noabaak said its because of the historical fit, but even Marlon Brando did not looks tight as me especially in shoulder.

Please accept my apologies if you are bothered, because there's no shop treating Schott near here, and motorcycle culture is next to nothing. No one knows about the real motorcycle jacket. And yes, I'm not in English speaking world, it was really difficult to collect the information.

lostandfound on 04/11/18 at 12:54 AM

nomailcomein wrote:

Thanks for all the opinions.

Actually, I'm regretting about my decision that not size up.

I'm currently looking for somewhere to sell this jacket, but your comments make me hesitate(And I don't think I can sell the jacket in good price in my region. They don't know about Schott).

I have no idea how it will broken in and how much it'll stretch, but until now, it pushs my shoulders quite unpleasantly, and it restricts my movement greatly. I can't fold my arms completely and sometimes my arms become numb. And will the shoulder stretch?

Because I have similar experience with other branded jacket(which has much shorter arms, no bi-swing back, despite 4 years of wearing I failed to accommodate with it), I'm not sure if it's okay. And it might be because of my mood, the shoulder line does not looks right. Pictures I uploaded do not show enough. Noabaak said its because of the historical fit, but even Marlon Brando did not looks tight as me especially in shoulder.

Please accept my apologies if you are bothered, because there's no shop treating Schott near here, and motorcycle culture is next to nothing. No one knows about the real motorcycle jacket. And yes, I'm not in English speaking world, it was really difficult to collect the information.

Tbh in your pic, it actually looks too loose in the shoulders.....

You couldve even gotten a size smaller than you did. 

You have to give it at least a couple weeks.  Trust me it's not too small on you. 

If it was too small, the jacket and shoulders would be suctioned onto you and there would be no room at all.  It would be literally skin tight so you couldn't even tell the difference between you with it on vs off.   

 

That's not how it looks on you in your pic, it looks loose in the shoulders, and it will just get looser, you will see.  The Steerhide on the 613 is the stiffest leather besides the horsehide, so you have to let it loosen up.  

RobertJ on 04/11/18 at 01:49 AM

^^^ The above is absolutely correct. Relax. Wear the damned thing. Again, steerhide jackets do not fit like cashmere sweaters. It is just a shock to your system. Have patience and you will end up with a lifelong friend.

lostandfound on 04/11/18 at 02:45 AM

nomailcomein wrote:

how much it'll stretch

It won't "stretch", "stretch" is a word that gets tossed around but it is not accurate, the leather won't stretch, it just kind of "loosens up" a bit

 

it's like a leather baseball glove, at first it is stiff, then it loosens up a bit.  but it doesn't stretch and become larger.  

 

Noabaak on 04/11/18 at 10:20 AM

nomailcomein wrote:

Thanks for all the opinions.

Actually, I'm regretting about my decision that not size up.

I'm currently looking for somewhere to sell this jacket, but your comments make me hesitate(And I don't think I can sell the jacket in good price in my region. They don't know about Schott).

I have no idea how it will broken in and how much it'll stretch, but until now, it pushs my shoulders quite unpleasantly, and it restricts my movement greatly. I can't fold my arms completely and sometimes my arms become numb. And will the shoulder stretch?

Because I have similar experience with other branded jacket(which has much shorter arms, no bi-swing back, despite 4 years of wearing I failed to accommodate with it), I'm not sure if it's okay. And it might be because of my mood, the shoulder line does not looks right. Pictures I uploaded do not show enough. Noabaak said its because of the historical fit, but even Marlon Brando did not looks tight as me especially in shoulder.

Please accept my apologies if you are bothered, because there's no shop treating Schott near here, and motorcycle culture is next to nothing. No one knows about the real motorcycle jacket. And yes, I'm not in English speaking world, it was really difficult to collect the information.

 

By 'history', I meant your personal history of clothing, not a chronological history of a past. 

If I were you, I would simply sell it on eBay or Trade section on this website. 

It's a good jacket, you should be able to sell it.

 

Cheers. 

 

 

 

 

LaughnJar on 04/11/18 at 11:13 AM

LOSTANDFOUND you're spot on.  Watering down leather WILL "SHRINK" it by leaching it's essential oils, and make it dry/stiff/brittle.  A fact that David Shapiro and Johnny Cochran most certainly realized along with knowing a little human biology; 81-86% water content of human blood.  An easily understood concept, inexplicably left unaddressed by the DA, that should have eviscerated the "If it doesn't fit..." lymerick that ths vintage leather-junky will never forget!  lol!

Which is why it is of utmost importance to treat water impregnated leather with a premium conditioner asap and NOT use hot air to get it dried out.  Saturated leather coats, gloves, pants may not even be salvageable no matter what one does to treat them.  Just too much water to counter.

??

LaughnJar on 04/11/18 at 11:45 AM

nomailcomein wrote:

Thanks for all the opinions.

Actually, I'm regretting about my decision that not size up.

I'm currently looking for somewhere to sell this jacket, but your comments make me hesitate(And I don't think I can sell the jacket in good price in my region. They don't know about Schott).

I have no idea how it will broken in and how much it'll stretch, but until now, it pushs my shoulders quite unpleasantly, and it restricts my movement greatly. I can't fold my arms completely and sometimes my arms become numb. And will the shoulder stretch?

Because I have similar experience with other branded jacket(which has much shorter arms, no bi-swing back, despite 4 years of wearing I failed to accommodate with it), I'm not sure if it's okay. And it might be because of my mood, the shoulder line does not looks right. Pictures I uploaded do not show enough. Noabaak said its because of the historical fit, but even Marlon Brando did not looks tight as me especially in shoulder.

Please accept my apologies if you are bothered, because there's no shop treating Schott near here, and motorcycle culture is next to nothing. No one knows about the real motorcycle jacket. And yes, I'm not in English speaking world, it was really difficult to collect the information.

I just took a look at your pics.  And in light of your words, "...no motorcycle culture here..." and "...maybe my mood..." and (did everyone miss this), "sometimes my arms become numb."???  Holy no way does that fit you no matter how an observer percieves the fit to be!  I had nearly the same of your last two stated experiences when trying to convince myself and forcably coerce a non-returnable full grain leather jacket, that it was going to fit!!!  Including hyper conditioning the poor thing, slinging it over my pull up bar and grabbing on to the elbow of each sleeve to hang all of my 165# mass from it in the failed endeavor.  One of a few energy draining ideas I employed to no positive result, lol!  And my mood about the coat situation NEVER IMPROVED.  It is better to cut your losses, sell it for as much as you can get and buy a jacket that feels good; or you will never will wear the coat or feel good doing so. And if you actually RIDE, lack of range of motion and numbness could be deadly.  

 

It sucks.  I know.  But avoid the battle that is way beyond "breaking it in".  Breaking in a leather jacket should still feel ok, even kind of good; like the satisfied feeling of a little muscle pain and stiffness the day after a good workout!

 

peace

nomailcomein on 04/13/18 at 12:48 PM

Thanks for your concerns and reply.

While wearing the jacket with t-shirt only makes slightly more acceptable movement and fit, I think the size is not for me. I don't know if the people of 50's were actually wearing these jackets based on there chest size or not(The size means jacket's actual chest size, not wearer's chest size, isn't it?), but as a protective garment, I think range of motion is crucial. Although it can be stiff and takes more force to move before broken in, but it should not prevent my movement, right?

But I don't sell it right now as they will not get a good price in here. Although it fit tight, it looks really cool. After all I can't get a good price for it, I can wear it as much as I can.

I saw Perfecto jacket(maybe not genuine Perfecto, but same design) in my teen age, I never forget that moment. It becomes the coolest jacket ever made for me. Wearing this jacket is really something for me.

It's a shame that I didn't ask about the size to Ms. Hawkins before purchase. I saw too many pictures of ridiculously large arms(Now I know that they are not really fit like that, I have no idea why they choose the size like that.) and it affects my decision.

Thank you all for your sincere opinions for me.

 

And if anyone want to purchase my jacket, please let me know. It wrinkles at some point but there's no distinctive damage. And if you want some more information about the jacket, I will take a picture and show you. I can't accept the payment via PayPal(they block my account permenantly because they can't understand my non-latin name), but any others like Stripe, etc. might work.

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